VvV Ideas

Dan

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#41
https://uo.com/wiki/ultima-online-wiki/combat/virtue-versus-vice/
  • When at least 2, non-allied VvV players are logged into the game a random Virtue City will be open for battle.
  • When a VvV player enters an active battle region a battle status gump will open indicating their guild’s scoring progression as well as important match updates.
  • At the start of the battle non-VvV players will receive a warning gump indicating that if they do not leave the battle city they will be open to attack. (pictured above)
  • Any non-VvV player entering the city during the battle will receive the same warning gump.
  • VvV players can score points for their guild in a variety of ways:
    • Being the only guild/alliance to occupy the city
    • Killing opposing non-allied VvV players. There is a 5 minute timeout between when a player’s death results in the killer’s guild receiving points.


I believe it is only when inside the battle region. Otherwise you'd have the same issue where players afk kill each other, anywhere, to farm silver.
 

DewCono

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#42
If you can now participate anywhere it only makes sense to give silver for kills brought on by the vvv system. Yeah there's a chance of people farming each other, but unless you remove all the rewards that will always be a thing. People will game the system as long as they have something to gain from it. While I understand you're trying to revitalize this system realistically it's taking something from players they've had for a long time so pretty much any changes proposed won't be well received.
The system currently screams avoid me.
 

Noah

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#43
That would be awesome. However, it could be exploited. Friends killing each other for points ya know. It would need a limit of say 10 points per kill(?) per person per day?
 

DewCono

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#44
How do you think I got the points I needed in the first place?
 

Dan

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#45
Yeah if we decided to implement this I would like a check to make sure the target is 1. not using the same IP (I know I know, VPN, but at-least they will experience lag, waste VPN time, pay for one) 2. Keep the 5 minutes between kills, and 3. add a total that can be obtained, per day, this way.
 

Dexter

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#46
And/Or keep track of kills/deaths, etc. Not just during the battles, but overall.
 

Dexter

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#47
The the whole thing about players not wanting to play because of changes is a bit of an over reach, since its one of the many dead systems. So, trying to spruce it up won't hurt anything. Factions had a deal where you could only gain silver from kills once per day or so. We could limit each person to 10 silver, per player per day.
 

Dan

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#48
I believe once me and Dexter sit down and hash out how to handle VvV rewards that will change. We are just trying to get the framework in for a better system.

Here is the current suggestion I have to improve the rewards. The equipment pieces are also some of the best slotted pieces in the game. However I do understand that it can be frustrating to farm the silver to have the Antique item decay after only a few fights.

  1. Make the equipment rewards cost more silver. About 4 or 5x as much.
  2. Make any new equipment rewards spawn as Brittle with 150/150 durability instead of Antique with 255/255 durability.
    • Brittle does not make them decay faster. A Brittle item with 150/150 durability is EXACTLY THE SAME as a [replica] item farmed from a champion spawn. These items will last quite a bit often.
    • Any old VvV items will remain Antique until they are used up.
  3. The current VvV horses are next to useless and are never used on UO.
    • Maybe create a VvV ethereal horse that comes in the Virtue or Vice color?
  4. The VvV shroud is useless and does nothing. I am interested in ways to revamp it. I Posted a picture above of one possible example.
 

Noah

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#49
The concept seems to be to get more players to pvp. So with the current changes, I see the following happening.

1. Adding the ability to fight on any facet will deter 75% or more of the "abusers" who got VvV items from being able to use them IMO.
2. Adding the ability to fight on any facet will give more excitement of running into opposing players.
3. Fighting for alters will be more appealing if the points are increased for battles, and less are given for uncontested fights.


I agree with Dexter. The old system is dead. Sprucing it up will not hurt anything, and those who were or are in VvV will hopefully see an increase in pvp and less abuse of the items that were too frequently gotten by absolutely doing nothing. Not sure if its the after holiday effect or the new VvV sytem in place, but the bank has a lot less people sitting around collecting "loyalty" whom all used to wear VvV items..

Limiting the amount of points one player can accumulate from killing someone will definitely be needed! Anyone caught exploiting this should be dealt with otherwise the VvV system will be as useless as before.

As with any system/event, it will need tweaking with the growing community, and increase of pvp.
 

DewCono

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#50
I agree the system needs tweaked as well, but why not address the issue in the first place? What can be done to increase PvP so that the systems suited towards PvPers (but exploited by PvMers) are actually worth doing in the first place. This seems to be a 2 fold thing:

1. Make it a little more difficult to obtain the rewards, and use them.
2. Get people to actually pvp

Now I may be the minority, but I have to be in a really specific mood to PvP in the first place. Trash talk and PvP go hand in hand, but if I have to be berated/harassed to partake in a system I'll just avoid it. As it stands unless blackthorn dungeon gets a revamp you'll be hard pressed to get a lot of people excited about changing VvV at all. The artifacts for what they offer (granted they are slightly better) are easy to get, but if you have a "real" crimson, or a "real" mace and shield glasses.. what does VvV have to offer as a reward at all? Blackthorn Dungeon itself you can sit down and farm 100 points in a day with a ranger. That's 2 mace and shield helmets (formerly 1.6million friends of brit library points which would cost a player something like 180,000 bucklers for the same reward).

Instead of the current rewards VvV offers it should have something exclusive to it that you can't get anywhere else.

If I were to make the calls (which I don't, but I'll speak my mind anyways) I would scrap the whole damned system, and replace it with some kind of faction/VvV amalgamation. Give players a random team when they join while balancing the teams population (so that you can't just stack the teams in your favor) and rewarding the top X weekly-monthly players with (silver?) to spend on actually exclusive rewards.
Is a system like that also exploitable? Yes.. if there's a will there is a way.
Will the players who ACTUALLY PvP partake in it? I'd imagine so since it's one big wang waving contest.
Will players who are unaware that the VvV system is changed on what is supposed to be an OSI clone not sign up for VvV unknowingly? Most likely no.
 
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DaBeanCounter

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#51
I don't consider VvV items a reward really - they are more an accessibility feature to allow people to participate without having to worry so much about gear. That's really my biggest gripe. There isn't really anything worthwhile to fight over. No prize. Dan was on to something when he suggested that when a guild wins a city, they obtain a temporary bonus along the same lines as being governor and dropping 2m - that would be a good start.
 

Dan

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#52
These are the most up to date changes made to VvV:

VvV Changes
  • Vice Vs Virtue combat will be active on all facets.
  • Entering the region of an active VvV battle will flag any VvV as combat restricted (Heat Of Battle) which will prevent recalling / gating away.
  • Silver gained during a VvV battle, while uncontested (no opposing VvV players in the region) will reduce silver by 50%.
  • Non VvV players who flag VvV will now only remain flagged for 10 minutes (down from 30). Remember assisting or fighting VvV in any way will restart this timer.
  • If a Non VvV player flags VvV in one facet but then travels to another it will now clear them of being flagged for VvV.
    • Remember you can not travel when Heat of Battle if active.
  • Some VvV rewards have had their prices increased.
  • VvV equipment will now spawn as BRITTLE instead of Antique and have 150/150 durability.
    • Brittle does not make items decay quicker. Instead these items are = to Replica items obtained from champion spawns and simply just can not have Powder Of Fortification applied to them.
  • VvV mounts and Essence of Courage have been removed.
  • Players can now purchase VvV Ethereal Horses and Ostards for 15,000 silver.
    • These Ethereals come Blessed.
    • Can only be used while you are in VvV and are Owner restricted.
    • Provide a 5% PvM damage reduction bonus, while mounted.
We have a few more new rewards on the way and will continue to listen to player feedback in regards to these VvV changes.
 

DaBeanCounter

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#53
if you are a NON VvV participant and enter a VvV battle town, you should leave or you will get HOB on you.
 

Dan

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#55
Well this is dumb...
That is only in Felucca. You do not want to be there anyways as you WILL flag VvV and this has ALWAYS been the case, since day one of VvV. Lets keep these posts constructive with actual input.

  • At the start of the battle non-VvV players will receive a warning gump indicating that if they do not leave the battle city they will be open to attack. (pictured above)
  • Any non-VvV player entering the city during the battle will receive the same warning gump.
https://uo.com/wiki/ultima-online-wiki/combat/virtue-versus-vice/
 

Noah

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#56
I think there hasn't been too many people who have gotten back in to VvV, at least not that I've seen running around except for a few OC, & Magus.
Fights have been non-existent that I'm aware of, mostly because lack of participants on at the same time I'm assuming. BUT, when I log on to my VvV char, there's always someone logged in that gives the opportunity for a battle in a designated town. It seems odd that less players are in VvV, but there's always a fight available... just wondering if somethings not working properly or is someone always staying logged in?

what would be cool if everyone in VvV agrees, could we get a stone, which indicates which guilds, or even which chars are logged in to VvV so we can challenge them?

If I could get more OC logged in these days, I'd even set up some scheduled town raids. Of course right now it would be just me and Magus. A few other OC have logged in here and there, but if ZEAL guild could organize a date and time Im sure I can get a few to log in to have some friendly guild battles?
 

Dexter

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#57
PvP lessons, particularly for field fighting would go a long way!

But yea, how about vvv bounties where it shows you how many opposition are online. Maybe some extra silver if you kill your bounty.
 

Dan

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#58
The ability to go to a set stone and see all VvV online is a neat idea.

Maybe also set up a new alter, in a different location, that once a week, at a set time, needs to be controlled (maybe for 30 minutes to an hour) and those of the winning guild get a unique new item or mount?
 

DewCono

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#59
It would be cool to scrap the vvv system for something along the lines of a "challenge system".
My ideas for the challenge system include :
A champ spawn that keeps track of damage dealt / player kills / monster kills / boss contribution.
At the end the scores are tallied up, and points are given out. Requires 2+ vvv guilds on site to start/accept the challenge. (chance to receive a [relic of the factions] which are essentially vvv replica artifacts).

Capture the flag. You have to pick the flag up (two handed halberd graphic when held / banner on ground when dropped/invisible/killed)

King of the arena. Each vvv guild selects a participant (or x participants) to fight in a tournament where only one guild can be victorious.

The labyrinth of lost souls. A 3v3, or 5v5 moba similar to Rakion where the goal is to beat down enemy waves (and players) to defeat the golem on each side of the field.


Vvv is just run off the mill pvp. People can do that without vvv. The system should offer something you can't get anywhere else.